Ep. 7 – Investor Chat: Brandin Pettersen, Owner of RealOvative Realty and Founder of REI Op-Center

Brandin Pettersen has been in the real estate business for over 12 years, is the owner of RealOvative Realty and co-founder of REI Op-Center. Brandin started off as a deal analyzer, then real estate agent, then wholesaler and flipper. He’s done it all, ridden several economic cycles, and now focuses on building an incredible remote team of rockstars.

Hey, everybody, it’s Jordan Fleming here with another episode of That Real Estate Tech Guy. Today is an investor episode and I’m delighted to welcome to the podcast, Brandin Pettersen. Brandin, welcome to the podcast. Why don’t you tell us a bit about yourself and your company?

I’m awesome, man. I appreciate you having me on. It’s always an honor to be on a podcast, especially with you. I’ve been using your product a while. Let’s see, I’ve been doing real estate since 2009, 2010, kind of dabbled in it. I started out as an investor, got into being a realtor, broker, went back to flipping, got into wholesale, house wholesaling. Back then we didn’t call it wholesaling. We called it hooking people up with deals, back before YouTube and all that. When I actually heard of it as a true business, 2017-ish, I think I got your product, I started to use smrtPhone in ’18, ’19 summer? Don’t quote me, somewhere around there. I mean, I’ve been using you for forever, man. It’s a funny story, actually. Because I was initially using cell phones, just having my team use cell phones. And the problem was we used our office phones ..

Actual buttons! You know, those cables that go into walls?

Exactly right, and then my team needed to text. So they were texting from their cell phones, and eventually, laisse- faire attitude, they started using everything on their cells. The problem was when I started losing, you know, people exiting, they were taking all those contacts with them, all of the conversations, the details. I said at that point, I think that’s when I knew I needed a product. I was Googling hardcore man. And somehow – I don’t even know, it’s been so long – somehow I came across your company, and I’ve been using you ever since for our VoIP system.

That’s fantastic. I mean, I am fascinated given that you’ve been in the real estate, within a lot of facets, game for a while. The reason I kind of decided to do this podcast was there are lots of folks who are very good and very knowledgeable about the kind of technology they use. But I would say it’s, like, a 10% of what, you know, the main population doesn’t really dive into the technology enough. And so I’m really fascinated from a phone system point of view, the pain point was really A. people texting, and B. people using their own devices, which is screwing you up. What about if you think about your journey, in a technology sense. How did you go CRM, then phone system? What was that journey like?

Listen, man, you got to understand though, that question, it’s kind of like a double edged sword because there was no technology when I started.I’m not old, right? But in 2009, 2010, we didn’t have the tools that we have today, technology wasn’t something. And it sounds like it was so long ago, but really in 2010,  there was no Instagram, YouTube, all of this stuff that you were learning from or utilizing. I mean, I was using Excel. And I was a realtor back then. So I kind of dabbled in the CRM. But realtors are very anti-technology, anti-structure because they get into it for freedom. And it takes a lot for them to learn. Plus, a lot of realtors are transient. So when you learn from one brokerage and use their system and you leave for another one, it’s like you have to learn a whole nother system of technology. So I wasn’t really utilizing tech, even in my flips. When I was flipping it was like in my younger days, like it was all cell phones, photos, Excel, text messages back and forth. I actually I have a tablet now but back then I just had a marble notebook. I was keeping all my budgets and everything in like a Moleskin you know what I mean? And I don’t think until I got into wholesaling, that I started looking at tech. I think my first system was I paid some dude from India for Podio, found him on whatever it was back then. I had him make me a hodgepodge of a Podio system. And that was that and when I got Podio is when I started looking that was when I had the issue, it was like a transition, we were using our old phones and notebooks. And then from that point, we got our CRM, people started leaving, I said, Hey, I got this technology. Now I need the next thing for VoIP for an online system for phones. And that’s when I found smrtPhone. So I would say I got my CRM first, then I went into my phone system. So that’s kind of like my path into the tech.

Remarkably different. I think a lot of investors now won’t really have ever done the Excel. They’ll have bypassed that now. But I mean, in terms of a change, and the things that a good CRM brought you, what are you using right now?

I use a couple things for tech, but my main CRM is InvestorFuse, IF3, highly recommend it. If anyone needs the hook up, let me know. I’ve worked with John closely on that. And I love it. I mean, it makes the whole action-based system, it’s a professional CRM, I love it over Podio. We have click-to-call obviously, smrtPhone is huge.

Literally just launched that integration! Just launched it. 

I mean, I was always using you with InvestorFuse, but your ease of use into InvestorFuse, the way you guys customize it now with InvestorFuse. If you guys don’t have it you need to check it out. I mean, it’s very custom into there. And so that definitely helps with everything, the way the call recordings get dropped into the CRM, the activity logs and everything in there for the agents to see. And they don’t necessarily need access into the back end admin system of smrtPhone, they can do it all from their CRM. Love it, man. And that’s definitely changed the game for us. I think it keeps us more organized. I see a lot of guys still using their cell phones and I don’t understand it. 

I don’t actually like giving anybody my phone numbers. I’m not even sure my mother’s got my phone number. I am: Do not text me, Do not call me, my phone number is there for me to — my phone is there for me to access data. And I don’t ever want to hear it ring. 

I use your system. So I have a cell phone on smrtPhone that is in my email tagline. It forwards to my actual cell. So that way, for the wholesaling side of my business because obviously I flip, and I do other stuff, and rentals. But for the wholesaling side, even title companies, all them get my smrtPhone cell that forwards directly to my cell phone, and then I could pick it up and I see it – because you allow me to set the caller ID so I set the caller ID, I know exactly that it’s my wholesaling cell phone. That way no one gets my personal cell. And I like that. And I give that to the team too.

Yeah, absolutely. Let me dive into the InvestorFuse bit for a bit because I’m always curious. You’ve obviously gone through the technological wars, but you also went through a Podio system? I don’t know, did you go to InvestorFuse on Podio, and then move with InvestorFuse to IF3? or were you in Podio, and then moved to IF3? 

So I was in Podio. I knew John from way back in the day. And John has been trying to get me into IF3 in InvestorFuse, John’s the CEO of InvestorFuse, co-founder for people who don’t know, and he was trying to get me in and I was adamant against him, like, I got Podio, I got Podio, I got Podio, I’m fine. And then we started talking about what InvestorFuse was really doing and what it was becoming. And I switched over directly to the IF3 version of it, the third version, so I never touched any of the earlier versions from it. And that’s when we started instituting a lot of the big features. And now you guys, I think one of the biggest features released this year was the Click-to-Call with smrtPhone. 

I have a sort of weird scenario where obviously I’ve run a platform that lots of investors use, but I myself don’t use them all very often. I don’t have a need to do sales like that on the phone. But I’m always curious – I’ve talked a lot with John about InvestorFuse, IF3, and he talks about the next action element of InvestorFuse. Can you walk me through you and your team moving to InvestorFuse, what are the sort of really key things that you’re getting out of a CRM for your team now? I think there’s a lot of investors who listen to this set of podcasts, and they’re trying to figure out what CRM to go through. So tell us a little bit why InvestorFuse’s working for you.

I’ll actually give some value and kind of break down what we do. So InvestorFuse is an action based system, the difference between this CRM and other ones is, I don’t tell my guys what to do, right? We don’t have these empty statuses that you have to remember who’s next, or set tasks or anything like that. So in fact, they get to set their own schedule of what we call action based, right? And so every time with smrtPhone when you log – and it’s funny, because I just made the training video for it this morning, because we’re updating our training programs – when we go in, we open up a lead, we click-to-call immediately using smrtPhone because we have the web extension, and we click-to-call. And as it’s dialing, we move over to what’s called the action page. And it’s two questions. Did I get a hold of this, that I talked to the seller? Or did I not talk to the seller? While it’s ringing, we’re waiting. If it doesn’t pick up we go: I did not talk to the seller. Simple as that. And then immediately it comes: what do you want to do next? So we have a couple ways our leads go. We have leads and opportunities, so a lead is called new lead or call attempts. So when I’m trying to make that initial contact, if call attempt two, what do you want to do? Next call attempt three, call attempt four, and so on and so on. Or if I get a hold of them I can then select, hey, I got a hold of them, what do you want to do next? Follow up with seller, follow up on offer. So I’m picking my next action and it automatically moves it down your pipeline from a lead. Call new lead, call attempt to an opportunity, following up with the seller, following up on your offer. Due diligence these things or if you’re in person, seller appointment, and all that we don’t do in person. So we’re strictly phone based. And so what happens is because of these actions, they’re actually scheduling out their day, just like a real salesperson. I’ve done door to door sales, I’ve sold products, I’ve done a lot of stuff in my younger days. And you would have to fill up your schedule of your pipeline, right, you’d have to manage your pipeline. So my guys, when they come in, they say hey, man, I said I was going to follow up with these five sellers. Today I had 10 offers I made, I had to follow up on this guy, I owe due diligence on these ones I still haven’t got a hold of and I have to call attempt two, three and four them today. And those are their actions that they have to do. And we do that all from the CRM using smrtPhone.

 

What I love about that, as well, is as someone who’s built CRMs for real estate investors, I’ve been guilty of this in the past. They can get really complex, and they can get super busy in terms of you looking to lead and you’re almost overwhelmed with information and statuses and the options that you can do. What I really loved, what I found really interesting about that, and your description of IF3 from InvestorFuse is, is the way it can kind of focus the mind of the agent. You know, it’s like, fuck the noise. You call this guy now, get them or not, Oh, you got them? What do you want to do? Yeah. 

And it’s different than a task, man. So a lot of people go, Oh, those are tasks, are not tasks, I’m not filling up these empty tasks so that I can have 10 tasks on a lead. You cannot have a lead without an action in the system, meaning truly – people use the term but this is truly – no lead left behind. Now, InvestorFuse also allows us, we call it groups or buckets. So when they’re done through the day, like all of our new leads from cold calling stuff, they get dropped into like a closers bucket for the closers. So when they’re done doing their clicking-the-call and dialing all the people that they told themselves that they were going to do today, they then go oh, you know, it’s noon. Okay, let me go and grab some new leads. I’ve done all my follow ups. I’ve talked to all the people or have attempted to, texted, all that stuff. Let me go grab new ones and add to my pipeline, so I can build my pipeline and manage it. So they’ve started the day by managing and following up with their pipeline. And by the end of the day, they’re adding and rebuilding that pipeline, because you can work all the leads in your system, but if you’re not constantly adding to the front end of it, you’re gonna wind up with a dead pipeline. That snowball effect is going to be lost.

Yeah, absolutely. I really love that description of the genuine no lead left behind because it’s not cluttered. It’s literally just the next step. Fuck five steps down the road. Stop pretending like you got 15 tasks on a lead. This is the thing you need to do. And then nothing else matters because you can’t do anything else until that’s done. That’s really interesting. 

It is and you know, with any system and technology, especially with employees, they’re going to always try to skirt this system. So we have training involved in our manager. I got a sales manager, he knows what to look for to make sure they’re doing what they’re doing, and they’re not pushing stuff forward or doing that. So with technology, there has to be some type of oversight in it to make sure it’s being utilized properly. So we institute that as well.

And have you found when you made those switches, and you in particular, maybe when you switched to IF3, did you find that your team was able to adjust? There’s always gonna be some friction when you move a system, there’s always going to be, I used to do this, and now I got a muscle memory something else…

So I’ve switched a couple systems, right? When two of the biggest changes I’ve made, switching from Podio to InvestorFuse, and then switching from Excel to my data platform, REI Op-Center, right? Each one of those things was drastic for us. Let’s just say it, Podio is not really technology, okay? Like, I know, it’s gonna hurt some feelings out there. But it’s not a real CRM, it was never designed to do that for us. So it’s almost like stone age style stuff, just like when I kept my data in Excel and moved that into a real platform. Those were some of the biggest hurdles to make as a business owner because I had to redesign our SOPs and our processes. So John came to me when we did the InvestorFuse merging, he’s like, do you want me to like white glove? And that’s the beauty about InvestorFuse, the white glove view. And I said no. So actually using smrtPhone, because I had smrtPhone hooked into my Podio. I had smrtPhone hooked into InvestorFuse, I actually created a Podio campaign. I set two of my people aside and their job was to go through like 20,000, whatever it was, it was their only job, dial everybody. And then if they say yes, push them in the InvestorFuse, if they say no, mark them as dead, dead, dead, dead. And that’s actually where the InvestorFuse resurfacing concept came about is because I was resurfacing all of my Podio leads to move them into InvestorFuse. So was it a pain? Yes. Was there a little bit of a process jump there? Yeah. But we kind of pivoted and instead of trying to bog our new system down, we actually made our old CRM into a marketing campaign set to people to just focus on those with texting and calling out of smrtPhone. And then they would push –John put a button in for us, his team put a button in – as soon as they click the buttons, it went straight over to InvestorFuse, and then that lead was there for our closer.

Oh, yeah, the clean data in a CRM. When I see people start a new CRM, and they just import 15,000 shitty leads. Now, why would you do that? Why are you doing that to yourself?

You’re just bogging yourself down. It was a great opportunity. And we made a shit ton of money. That’s where that resurfacing concept came up. Because I made a shit ton of money, just resurfacing leads that we would have otherwise not touched by having somebody start from scratch. I told them to ignore other than the do not calls obviously. Check with your attorney, all that stuff. But other than the do not calls. We wouldn’t call those again. 

That’s fantastic. And it’s one of my biggest bugbears, is bad data. When I see people not keep their data clean. It goes to like, when I first started in business 18 years ago, or whatever it was, I remember going to a meeting with someone who said, you know, how many prospects do you have? And I was like, I don’t know, four. And he said, I’ve got 100. And I was like, really, you’ve got 100 prospects,? I think, really, you have 100 prospects. And of course, he was fooling himself, because he had probably four or five prospects, then he wasted time with the other 96. And I feel like that happens on CRMs all the time, when you know, I got 15,000 leads in my system, you probably have 300.

That’s the thing, and I can go down this road all the time. So when our sales process with the way InvestorFuse, the way we set up, and you made a comment earlier about how CRMs can be complex. InvestorFuse draws this very line where it has all of the complexity, but it makes the ease of use very easy, right? So we can set up a complex system in an easy way with InvestorFuse. So with resurfacing, my agents aren’t afraid. And resurfacing means we dead out a lead. So if I talk to you, and you say you know what, I decided to keep it. A lot of times people get a little, but he’s got motivation. Maybe I’ll just follow up with them in three months or six months, and I’ll call him and I’ll keep him in my lead bucket. And so he never dies. He just stays in this like long term nurture or something like that, or some long term follow up. And it bogs even if you’re not seeing it every day, it still bogs that total lead count down and that builds over time. So what we’ve done is we teach and we do training once a week, we go over CRM training every morning and we do a Morning Sales Meeting and Tuesdays is CRM training for 15 minutes before we do script training, and one of the things is knowing that it’s okay to dead a lead, because with InvestorFuse or technology, the system will automatically dead it out. We set up rules. And depending on the lead status in one week, two weeks, three months, six months, it resurfaces up into our follow up specialists, and they call it and if it’s the person, Hey, did you change your mind you want to sell? And they say, Yeah, you know, so and so died, we’re ready. Now, they move it back over to the closers. And now the closers refocus on it. But now what it’s done is that it’s allowed our team to stay clean with their pipeline and not keep so much in there. Like you said, the 100 of them, for fear that one of them might turn into a lead, it’s you talk to them, you move them through the script, the sales process, if it’s a no, that’s okay. We call it no pain, it’s pain, you can have motivation. But if you don’t have pain, then they don’t stay in your pipeline. You know, boom. Absolutely. And so that’s how we keep our data clean, and our pipelines clean, using the action based system.

Just cause we got data on our mind right now, I mean, there are loads of different technologies out there, companies out there, that provide data. Have you had any experience with some of those companies that you – if you’re buying data – any that you recommend over others?

It depends on what you’re going for, obviously, so we pull data from county records directly, we pull data from Batch, we have it. So we have an account on Batch where we get a subscription, we have an account on PropStream where we get a subscription, and we pull data from ListSource and DataZapp. Right? So we have five, yeah, I guess, five different sources. And I’m not gonna lie, we have some off data that we have, like, a couple people will send emails to to buy some niche list or something, but nothing crazy. But our goal, because we have our own call center, is we need to add 75 – 100,000 new lines of data every month, essentially, into the beast. So we’re always looking for data. That’s why we keep subscriptions on Batch and PropStream, not so much that I’m not going to recommend either one. Because honestly, if you understood how data works, they’re all coming from the same aggregators and sources, just depends on what level of hierarchy they’re at. Data’s data, man, it’s just a matter of how clean you could get it and how recently updated it is.

That’s interesting. I just asked because I’ve got some episodes coming up with some data companies. And at smrtPhone, we’ve been integrating some data points into the smrtPhone as well. So I’m always curious as to how people are dealing with data. Where they’re getting it, and a follow up just in terms of when you’re getting the data from these sources? If you’re doing those sort of four or five, whatever sources you’re talking about, how much do you track the effectiveness of each source?

We use a system. It’s REI Op-Center. It’s a system that I co-created with John, it’s a data platform. So with that, we’re actually able to pinpoint – think about it like it’s a database for all of your data, the way you buy it, you dump it in raw, no need for Excel, no need for anything. You dump it in, and you’re able to pivot and see or pinpoint and see where the most leads or deals, contracts are coming from, what sources they are. Because — right now, for example, when we got REI Ops-Center up and running, I had over 300, 400, Excel files, all in different folders. And that’s just the raw data. And then when you send it out to skip trace, you have to organize it. So then I got another 300. When you get it back from Skiptrace, you got another 300. Then when you clean it up to send out for marketing, you have more. So we couldn’t, to answer your question. We couldn’t track it at all, there was no way to tell, it was so horrible, we could track it as close to a category as possible. But to truly get down to the row of data was almost damn near impossible. Without a lot of VAs and a lot of work with REI Op-Center. Though it’s not hard, especially as we’re working on an integration with InvestorFuse, it’s very easy to tell where your data is coming from, and if it’s on more than one data source. So if you pull data from Batch and PropStream, we could tell that, hey, this was on both Batch and PropStream, but you pulled the Batch list in May and you pulled the PropStream list in June. So really, you’re gonna give credit to the May one, your Batch is going to get credit for that. And so the score goes up.

Interesting, that’s both fascinating for me. It sounds like I need to get the REI Ops Center on the podcast at some point very soon, which I’m excited to do. It’s one of my things that I’ve done always, you know, I always try and encourage people who are maybe setting up their first CRM or getting involved in data for the first time. If you’ve bought a list, or then you buy a different list, track what you’re getting from each, and not only track what you’re getting in terms of a financial return, but track the effort that’s going into each. Understand that so you can make informed decisions, do I want to buy more from here? Do I want to buy more of this type of lead? 

So I would say my recommendation, and I did this prior to having our REI Op-Center, is we have a guy on our team. He’s phenomenal. Every Excel sheet, if anyone follows me on Instagram, anything I ever show or show off? I didn’t create, we have a data guy who literally, this is his love of life is data. He just crunches. So he’s always in our Excel sheets, and I would recommend that somebody would find either a part time person online that can work and do what you need, or just bring, if you have the money, bring someone on full time to really do what Jordan’s saying. And that’s to understand your data. Whether you have a big platform like REI Op-Center, or you’re just in Excel, it is important that you have somebody on your team who’s able to figure out what deals you got, where they came from, what list source they came from, what skip source you use, what month you pulled it and how many times you’ve pulled it to know whether or not where you should be putting more of your money, essentially. And I think as a solopreneur, that can be tough to do because you’re doing everything else, Jordan, like your dialing, your sales, your dispo. So that’s where I would recommend if you don’t have a system to find a person, find a who to help you with the how.

That leads us nicely into the Fast Five questions! Five questions I ask all the investors who come on the podcast. I’m gonna guess some of your answers already. But I’m gonna fire ’em at you. I usually can guess…

He told me about the Fast Five as I got on the show. So I never heard these before. He says, did you get the PDF? And I was like, no! He’s like, yeah, you’ll be good. So this is 100% off the cuff. No idea what he’s going to ask me but I’m going to trust it’s meant to be so let’s do it. Man. Shoot ’em at me.

I went on the Best Ever Podcast and I think he’s got something similar. He’s got like three questions, you ask everyone. And I had no idea he was going to ask me that. And one of them was better that way. One of them was really nuanced. And I was like, oh, fuck, like, let’s, let’s get a good one for this one. So all right, question number one, and I’m gonna I’m gonna mentally guess what your answer is going to be on this: What technology product has had the biggest impact, the biggest single impact on your business?

I’d say smrtPhone.

I’ll take that answer.

Only because I’ve been using it the longest – back in 2018 ’19, when I started, it changed the way I did my business, the organization of everything.

Absolutely, I will take it. Question number two, what’s the biggest mistake you’ve made with technology and your business?

Not building processes, and training programs around it sooner, assuming that everybody was going to be able to “figure it out.” Because you know, learn by doing – not everyone is like me. I made a comment that I updated my training programs this morning on smrtPhone and InvestorFuse. And the thing is, create those training programs, hire someone to help you do it if you don’t have the time. But create a process and a training around the systems and technology that you use in your business and update them too, update them constantly.

It’s a living thing, right? 

Yeah, it’s a living thing. Yeah.

Question number three, what is the — well I’m gonna guess this may kind of go along with your answer number two, but what is the best advice you would have for someone new on how to integrate technology in your business? See above, I’m guessing,

I would say who not how, and when you’re integrating something, there’s a need to do it all yourself. I can understand that because I’m that type of person. It took me a lot. So when you say advice, the advice is, is find the person to do the task, don’t try to do the task – just write down what the task is, what impact it’s going to have, what the expectation looks like, if the implementation is success and what it looks like. So if it’s a failure, hand that off to somebody you hire, have them go and do it, create processes and training around it. From the start.

Awesome. Question number four, what’s the one thing you wish you’d known when you started your real estate business? The wholesaling one, let’s say. I coulda sent you the PDF before!

What’s the one thing I wish I would have known? I’m gonna go back to the fact of like, who not how. Stop doing everything yourself. And when I say who, not how, I don’t mean just the hiring of people. I mean, who I surround myself with. I wish I would have gotten in rooms a lot sooner with people better than me, and put my ego aside. And I think that would have pushed me further, faster, than me trying to figure it all out myself. And then the who not how, doing it all myself, I think I wasted a few years doing that. This year I’m working on my leadership, that’s my goal for 2022 was better leadership because I was the biggest sinner when it came to doing everything for everyone, you know, having to know everything. 

You Supermanned it? Superman. 

right? Like, I don’t know. 

We all do that. There’s not a single person I know who’s grown a successful business, that doesn’t have to have a moment where they put the Superman cape down. And usually, their life immeasurably improves when they do. But the business also does because you empower your people, and you create a better team.

There you go. But your question was, what do I wish I would have known? So like, when I when I bring it back? The reason why I say that is because where would I be? Everybody’s like that, a lot of successful business people. But what if somebody told me that in 2000, whatever, ‘17, ‘18, like when I started this full time, what if someone shared that secret and gave me like, you know, the golden transcript and like, here’s what you need to do: hire other people create process? Who, where would I be? If I knew that information? Problem is, like you said, we learn by doing… there’s that moment that you figure it out and mine took some years to figure that out.

Well, you got one question left. You’re speaking to someone who’s just starting in real estate and you have to say three technology products — doesn’t have to be the brand, but the type of product. CRM or lead gen or SEO, whatever you had to say these three things are what you should start with, what would your recommendation be?

I would say that’s easy, first thing you do is you go to InvestorFuse, purchase their premium edition, and let them know that I sent you and you’ll get a lot of training that goes along with that. Then connect with Jordan for smrtPhone because without a CRM, or with a CRM, you need a dialer. And most importantly, you need to connect with me to get REI Op-Center to organize your data so you could free it and understand your data better. And so that way you have your data side understood, your sales side understood, and you have your lead gen, your calling understood, your VoIP, those three things, you can’t go wrong. Don’t try to save money on it. Just make sure you budget for it.

That’s great. Absolutely. At the end of the day, I’ve always said to people, you can make all those things like E-signatures and automations around transactions, you can do that shit, but if you’re not getting leads, organizing them, following them up and closing them? Step two doesn’t happen.

100 percent. And then if you’re not tracking them, like you said, with the data, understanding your data, it doesn’t matter how much money you make, eventually it will fall apart. Eventually it’s all going to come crashing down. Be professional and get a frickin VoIP system like smrtPhone. Don’t be using your cell phone callin’ people from all different markets using your personal cell. Just get a system. Too many people skip that, I’m sorry man, too many people skip that step. They’re trying to save money and they don’t do that. I think that’s one of the biggest mistakes you can make, is trying to save that money and using your phone. Get your first deal, when you do, don’t spend any of it. Go reinvest it into systems and scale.

Absolutely. Well Brandin, it’s been a genuine pleasure to have you on the podcast. Last closing remarks to you, tell everybody how to find you, the things you want to point them to and I’ll make sure they’re in the podcast notes and and the website

You can find me on Instagram at mr.realovative and got a podcast called Let’s Talk Real Estate and Stuff. Let’stalkrealestate.tv. You can find me on either one of those two things. And let’s lock and load baby, I appreciate you having me on, this was a blast. Love, love talking technology and of course, love smrtPhone man, been using it forever. I’m gonna keep on using it. 

I appreciate it, man. And don’t forget, if you’re listening to this, do the things you’re supposed to do. Like, Subscribe, review. It really does help do all the things and make sure that other people, investors just like you can listen and learn from people like Brandin. Brandin, thanks. Have a great week, man.

Take it easy, man. Thank you.